Bonnie's advice sounds pretty good to me. Living aboard is definitely the way to go, but it ain't as cheap as most people seem to think.

Once I got the bug in my head that I was going to live on board a boat I spent two years looking at boats before I even made my first offer on a boat. I spent that time researching different boats and trying to learn as much as I could so that I'd know the right boat when I found her.

I live aboard my boat, Sandesta. She's a 1978 O'day 37. 37 ft is plenty of room for just me, and is about right for two if you're used to cozy surroundings. I'm a huge fan of center cockpit boats since they generally have two seperate cabins. Lots of self professed "real" sailors claim to strongly prefer the "drect feel" of an aft cockpit, but I say screw it. I like having the extra living space inside. Plus, it's easier to see what you're about to run into in a center cockpit and the boat feels smaller when you're triyng to put her back into a slip at a tight marina. If you like center cockpits you can probably pick up a decent Irwin 37, Gulfstar 36, Coronado 35, Endeavor 38, or if you're lucky a Morgan Out Island 36. Not as roomy inside, but they're nearly indestructible and have roomy engine compartments. The Irwin is nice because there's a walkthrough between the forward and aft sections of the boat (no need to climb into the cockpit). The O'day, however, is the best looking of the 35-39 ft center cockpit boats. But I might just be biased ;)

Hmmm. I've never actually seen a Coronado 35 nor do I know much about them, but just looking at an ad I just found they certainly look like a lot of bang for the buck in terms of interior room. adcache.boattraderonline.com/6/6....htm

Hmmm. Here's another one just down the coast from you in San Diego. adcache.boattraderonline.com/6/1....htm Bet you could get it for $16-18k, *and* it doesn't look like it needs a crazy amount of work. There are good deals out there, you just have to look for them.

Also, smaller is better. Find the smallest boat you think you can manage to live aboard. Adding ten foot to a boat doubles its cost. 30 ft boats are double the cost of 20 foot boats. A 40 footer is double the cost of the 30 footer. The cost difference between a 37 foot boat and a 41 foot boat is surprising. And that's the cost of everything. Boat slips, bottom paint, sails, you name it. Bigger boats cost way more than smaller boats.

I picked up Sandesta for $20k. $5k down, financed the rest for 5 years through Keybank. Pretty much everything worked, but she was a very basic boat. No hot water, no air conditioning, pretty much all the deck hardware leaked, sails were pretty so-so, the entire 120v electrical system consisted of half a dozen outlets wired to a single 30A breaker (with twist connectors and electrical tape). I had to motor the entire two day trip to bring her home to Panama City from Pensacola, and about 300 feet from my boat slip the old Yanmar blew an oil line and I had to be towed the rest of the way.

Once I got it home I spent a year working on the boat before I moved onboard. I wasn't planning on "camping", so I wanted some creature comforts. Air conditioner was about $1,300 from Tropical Breeze. Hot water heater was another $500. Plus all the various plumbing and electircal supplies for installing both of them. Took me about 8 hrs to install the water heater and maybe 24 hours to install the AC. But before that I had to redo the entire 120V electrical system with a new distribution panel ($250) and several extra breakers for the new items, plus the new wiring and misc. electrical supplies. Insurance is $750 per year (thanks to the idiots who don't take care of their boats when the hurricanes come) through Progressive. I'm about to buy a couple of new jibs (my boat doesn't have roller furling). Well, new to me. They're going to be used sails. Used sails in "okay" condition run you about $500 per sail. New ones are more like $2000 each. Eventually I'll have to replace the old Yanmar with a newer motor. Be seated before you ask how much a new marine diesel engine is.

Anyway, the point is that any boat that you can buy cheap is going to require about 50% to 100% of the purchase price in fixes, upgrades, and improvements. Bonnie recoomended you save $30k and buy a $12k boat... that would give you (probably) enough working money to get the work done that you need. Plus, keep in mind that if you plan on doing it yourself it's going to take a lot of time and effort. If you plan on paying someone else to do it, it's going to cost you a lot of $$$. The general rule of boating is to make your best estimate of mow much money something is going to cost and how long it will take you to do it. Then double the cost and triple the time and that's pretty much what it'll come to in the end. Again, though, the more you research and learn before you buy the boat the better off you are.

I pay a little over $300 a month for my boat slip. It's not a fancy marina, either. No bathrooms, showers, laundry, cable, phone lines, or anything. No fuel facilities, no storage lockers, no pumpout station (have to go to a next door marina for that). Dirt parking. The price includes electricity (a whopping 20 amps) and water but that's it. Some marinas charge an extra $100 or so as a "livaboard fee". Some marinas don't allow liveaboards. Some marinas have an 18 month waiting list. Be sure to check that out before moving on board.

Mooring is free, though. Unfortunately, I don't like cold showers in the mornings, and it gets pretty friggin' hot in the summer here in Florida (90 at night, baby!), so I don't think I could live aboard without water and air conditioning.

Don't worry too much about a lack of sailing experience. Buy a boat and you'll get experience. I didn't know much about sailing before I bought my boat.

Oh, be sure to get a professional reputable marine surveyor look over the boat before you buy, expecially if you're not too knowledgable about boats yet. Besides, you usually need a survey for the financing and insurance. Plus it can give you some negotiating points.

Bonnie: "Since I also am cheap, and also planning to live aboard full time in 5 years, i would love to hear the tribe's comments on what I've said."

A 5 year plan? Psh. If you already have a boat then you have no excuse. Move onboard tomorrow. No, tonight. This afternoon. NOW. There's nothing stopping you. I'm cheap, too, and I manage to get by. Pack your suitcase with as little as possible, get on board your boat and spend a couple weeks there to figure out what you actually need and bring that stuff on board. Give everything else away to charity (put the stuff you absolutely *have* to keep in a storage unit, or better yet a relative's attic). I promise you, you'll feel sooo liberated once you get rid of the junk you've been carrying around with you all this time.

My thought on the cost of a boat, being on boat number three, is that for a 36 foot mono hull, you are going to have a hundred grand into it before you are really ready to go anywhere. You can get a boat for 30k, but I would almost promise that it would need a new rig and motor. Boats way down wind in Mexico, Hawaii or Tahiti can be had much cheaper, but you are buying in a foreign country and parts availability, clear title can be a problem. I'm of modest means and recently divorced. I thought I was going to lose my boat. It would have taken me ten years to get another like I have. I had thought of getting a 27 foot folk boat, with an outboard or a plywood trimaran. The home built plywood trimaran, could really get one out cruising on the cheap. If you get a hole in it they raft. It can be beached and repaired. For 1500 dollars that it cost to get one you could burn it on the beach when you are through with it and take the bus home. I've seen two groups of twentysomthing surfers take two absolute piece of shit tri's and make it to Cabo. Going inside one of them, you could smell the rot. One would only turn left and the other had a cracked mast, when they left Ensenada.

People will take advantage of you, when you have the boat dream. I've been ripped off and seen others ripped off. All kind of shenanigans happens in boat deals. Selling a boat and not telling the new owner the slip doesn't go with it, for example. Don't buy a wood planked boat, take my word on this.

The learning curve around boats is real steep. Buy something you are not going to get hurt financially. A tight little 27 footer or a well built tri, then if you want trade up to a better boat. You'll probably have had more fun on the modest boat

Let me know when any of you have taken a budget boat and gone anywhere with it. I've seen it done with rotten trimarans and I know it happened in the 70's. From what I've seen over the years in Sausalito, the project boats just languish and don't go anywhere. I would like to hear some success stories. I think things are more expensive these days. This keeps the budget cruiser from getting very far.

O'day is good. You get the Waylon stamp of approval :)

...Yeah but, Now you're stuck with a Hunter!!!